Forum - View topicThis Week in Anime - Is Engage Kiss Ruined by Its Main Character?
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Changeman
Posts: 215 |
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Strawman argument not supported by anything in the column.
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b-dragon
Posts: 176 |
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The show definitely did itself no favors for the first few episodes, but since 3ish I've been really enjoying it. It scratches a certain trashy itch, while providing pretty decent action scenes.
I think Shu is impossible to like, hard to relate to, and any number of theoretically bad things for a protagonist- but he is interesting to watch, imo. Part of that is knowing that any situation he is involved in is about to be 1000% more magical soap opera, just from his involvement. And really, thats what I'm here for- a guy magically powering up a demon gf with memories of his exes. Thats the kind of wtf sentence that I adore anime for. I don't think that this show could fare well critically- there's too much that just isn't good. The side cast aren't well developed, the Bayron city stuff is honestly hard to care about, the main cast lean a bit too hard on their character "gimmicks", etc. But I'd be lying if I said I didn't have fun with it every week., |
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Mr. Nescio
Posts: 164 |
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Based on what I understand on this interview Maruto (the writer) pitched several different ideas, but only got the final OK after adding the element "all the characters are bad people" (the actual word used here is "dame", which seems to mean many kinds of "no good").
After reading Maruto's White Album 2 visual novel (3rd best ranked visual novel in vndb.org) I have been interested experiencing his other works. However, I'm not a fan of Engage Kiss. In addition of the generally middling execution I think that one of the main problems for me is that I would like to know more what the characters are thinking and why they behave the way they do. This might mean comparatively more telling than showing and of course taking more time, but then there would be a better chance of making me care. Despite these thoughts I'm still willing to watch till the end, even if there were an additional season/cour. |
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Chiibi
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I've watched up until episode 03 and I have no problem with Shuu. I think he's funny
 Then you start to feel pity for him once you find out what he's actually going through.
In this context, I believe "dame" would describe the characters more like 'hopeless people' (which they are) rather than actually bad people with no morals. ("warui"). Someone who wants to laze around and contribute nothing to society would be described as "dame" whereas an actual criminal would be "warui". |
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MFrontier
Posts: 5110 |
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Only a true writer of culture could understand the appeal of placing extra emphasis on a womans' stockings.
Is Shu scummy? Yeah, kind of. Does he string women along and use them for his own purposes (up to and including sex)? Yeah. Did he leave his girlfriend who genuinely loved him because of his personal crusade? Yeah. But he's also a man fiercely determined to get justice for his family no matter how much it costs him, and I think part of why he is scummy is how much he's sacrificing of himself with his memories to the point where he's giving up parts of himself and what he cares about in order to achieve his goals. It might not make him likeable, and maybe the "family" motivation is a cliche, but I think it makes him understandable and engrossing in the context of the series and Soma Saito plays this kind of character well. I feel like Ayano and Kisara's enmity with each other was part of what was the main draw of the first few episodes. I guess if you can't buy into their love for Shu to believe they would fight so much over him it would be one thing, but I don't think them being so hostile towards each other is a problem in and of itself or reinforcing outdated stereotypes because they're just one instance of it. I don't think under the circumstances there's any way they would be cool with each other. And even then as the season goes along there's some more nuance added to their relationship, especially when it comes to Kisara's guilt over stealing Shu's memories. I feel like Ayano has always been my dark horse favorite of the show, just from a design, personality, and voice standpoint. And she's probably the one who has suffered the most because of stuff out of her control, since Shu does what he does to himself willingly and left her for it and she never recovered from that. I also think it's deliberate that we haven't gotten much in-depth flashbacks to their relationship or how it came about because it emphasizes the loss because of how much of Shu's memories has been taken from him. And we see from later flashbacks that they were childhood friends and knew each other for most of their lives, so the age difference was probably 3-4 years. I don't think she was robbing the cradle at all, although timeline-wise it's kind of vague when they hooked up. Sharon is pretty awesome. I'm not seeing the issue with the police storyline? It offers a human perspective on the demon attacks, it's pretty reasonable that they'd actually want weapons to able to fight said demons with, and it eventually becomes very important to the plot. Is this like how Police in a Pod was dismissed as copaganda? I don't think the joke with Mikhail had anything to do with interest but just his one-track mind and rigid logic that he doesn't consider spying on his sibling in the shower wrong because they're siblings. It's meant to come off ridiculous. The surveillance state less so but I think the point by then is that Bayron City actually is pretty corrupt and messed up.
I don't really see how Ayano is "bad" beyond the fact that she can't get over her ex, but I feel like that's understandable considering the circumstances. |
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borderliner
Posts: 7 |
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To be fair the headline was "just asking questions" the answer being "No actually, in the context of the show Shuu's character works really well" It's also funny that they pick lots of neat moments in the show and then completely fail to diss them with any sort of authority. |
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FilthyCasual
Posts: 1753 |
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All of those screenshots and not a single one of tiny Ayano and Shu. Absolute dereliction of duty, unforgivable.
As for Engage Kiss, it's the show I look forward to most each week. I'm happy that it's exactly what I hoped for after seeing the PV. Bless its existence. |
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ANN_Lynzee
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 2633 Location: Email for assistance only |
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Nothing you wrote has anything to do with what was originally in the post. |
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Iron Maw
Posts: 338 |
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We saw a couple brief scenes from Ayano's perspective of what Shu was like in the past where he was seemly more responsible & reliable, but yeah it would be great if we got more of that to establish contrast between their relationship now and then.
Isn't kind of the point tho? Electricity, money, food and all those other human necessitates are things she doesn't need because she is a demon right? It doesn't even seem like Kisara will go hungry doesn't eat because of Shu's inconsistent work opportunities and poor money management. Kisara doesn't have do any of that or being in Bayron City at all. She doesn't come across as liking any other human beyond Shu and that included Shu himself at one point since she tried to kill him when they first met. Sure a regular person who depends these human necessities would have been fed up a long time ago particularly because it impact their own living standards and survival. Kisara does not because she has power. If anything she's living like human to keep Shu alive and minimizing as much inference in their relationship from others as possible. Heck we only seen Kisara school once with some of her friends and only noticeable person from that aspect of her life with a consistent presence is the idiot Student Council President/ Police Director General, which shows how important that all is. Rest of the show we just see her Kisara the demon, interacting other humans while her actual human cover is just window dressing. So naturally her perspective would entirely different from human one which makes this part of column at odds with being shown in the show. Like it hardly needs to be said that nobody should be endorsing Shu's currently lifestyle but the harm its actually causing Kisara is questionable at best because she in a fact demon before she is ever a highschool girl which might as well be cosplay. If they both survival at end of this show, Shu will grow old and die while Kisara will live on ageless and go on meet other contractors. So only the person in this relationship who being negatively affect by Shu's actions is himself. So I dunno, I feel like this being more dramatic than actually is. Rather Kisara's problems lie with his heart. Unlike Ayano I do feel its much more worth questioning why Kisara is so attached to Shu himself as individual. I imagine being saved from being made into a suit by the church plays a part in it, but I hope there is more to it.
Because it is. They doing it without knowing a single thing about Kisara, starting with the "boyfriend" bit they assumed entirely on their own. I'm not going to fault them being ignorant since it is Kisara intent is deceive them.
If feel like this column treating Shu like a rando Ayano and rest of cast only met for a day and they have near zero history together so hence the bafflement why they might care about him at all. Ayano's friend aside, from what we have seen from the past 9 episodes especially Shu's goes way back with a lot of cast. Ayano is literally his childhood friend from when they both toddlers (actually further back I think), and could have easily been his big sister if they weren't in a prior relationship. Akino (Ayano's mum), is a family friend, who trained both Shu & Ayano on how to fight demons. Shu also worked before under her company before he sudden quit 3 years a back. Its not just about Ayano these people know Shu too, they knew his family and have seen in various stages of his life much like Miles. They or at least Ayano & Akino know about tragedy that has haunted Shu for the better part of his life and probably have similar feelings about it with how close the Ogatas were with them. So it all much of surprise they aren't just dumping him and want to save him from his current destructive path?
That's because Shu is suffering much more significant repercussions than that, the financial hardships were only ever asides in the larger context of the show and has become much less of a problem in recent episodes. Shu isn't even hunting demons purely for a living anyway. Besides, like Kisara & Ayano will be fine, as I mention the former is a demon who doesn't really need any of our fancy human stuff to survive (she may just eat for pleasure of doing so rather than subsistence) and additionality as the column points out Ayano is independent working woman who is whole entirely detached from Shu financially. Meanwhile Shu is living in the past because his entirely life is driven by a traumatic event he's yet to find closure to which he still has nightmares about, has been betrayed by the person who raised him and finally is slowly losing his memories and emotions. Things he should care about more he's caring less and is even ultimately chipping away at his reason for living. That what's causing pain for others around him. I mean Kisara & Ayano have a discussion about this very thing that hits the very nature of their animosity towards each other. Even if you remove the part of about Ayano and Shu being exes the former is still watching one of her closet friends deteriorating in front of her eyes and person partially responsible is just standing by letting it happen. Out of her own guilt, obsession & inability to stop Shu, so just resign to picking up the pieces when the inevitable happens. That's "juicy" drama imo. I'm kind of surprised TWA didn't mention it all but I supposed its fair given the level investment the host week had in it. That said doesn't mean the lesser issues aren't still problems and he shouldn't apologize from but the principal cast know these just symptoms of a much deeper problem. Honestly with recent episodes his action in his personal life come off as more negligence than maliciousness in his one mind-track goal in his search for his lost sister.
I guess this wasn't your intent but this almost reads that a character needs to be black or white without any contradictory feelings or actions to be decent written. Yes, Shu's present character and raison 'dere is entirely driven his past and you cannot diovice that from him. Yes it also means he will end up hurting and helping the people around him as it often the case for people shaving their lives away in the search of one goal but in his case its largely unintentional. In that sense Shu reminds me about a lot of trauma suffering protagonists like early on their stories like Guts in Berserk before their eventual change. However I think the reason the treatment of Shu actions in the early episode lightly is because the status of Shu relationship with the people around him make them that much benign that would under worse circumstances so he's only really being harmed materially. Its bigger damage is emotional. Plus pass episode 3 and up this fall by wayside as Shu living situation improves while the show delves deeper into he characters. Like the one episode recontextualizes Kisara relationship with Shu and showed she not merely yandere and is entirely capable of being thoughtful and even considerate to Ayano. Ayano herself later own proven she not always the girl scout-ike figure she appears. Yeah these thing still happen in relation to Shu but their still character expansion that make them little fuller then were in the beginning. So Shu being a respectable person in the past at least before he met Kisara, and still retaining hat kindness isn't hard to believe. I mean we have seen he genuinely feels bad about his neglect impacting others around him and at end of the day he's saved hundreds of lives with his power even if this was not his primary intent. He's known as the best demon hunter in Bayron for nothing. They way I see it is that without context of his past, Shu in the beginning of Engage Kiss is presented a lot worse than he really as is the rest of everyone's relationship to him. The deaths of Ogata family is the starting point for a lot narrative for not just Shu but characters closest to him without Kisara for example wouldn't even exist in the story. So I don't think Shu was ever intended to stay trash, but rather portrayed as a person in bad place in his life right now. All in all though I don't have any particular strong feelings about Shu. I do find him more interesting as character now then I did in beginning when he was "just" floppy deadbeat. That mainly thanks to some bits from his past others talk about and fact his relationships with Ayano and Kisara have gotten more nuanced. Yeah Engage Kiss has certainly has trashy aspects but speaking as someone I didn't really like this show early on and was on the verge of dropping it until ep 3 I am surprised at how it has been keeping my interest since then. Especially with the latest reveal. Sorry for this being so long 
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kinghumanity
Posts: 358 |
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I like Shu a lot more than I like the generic limp dick teenage boy MCs that are rampant in anime that we’ve seen 28638 times.
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